Someone asked you for a source and all you said is history? Are you sure you actually know queer history because its starting to look like your pulling this argument out of your ass now.
honestly first n foremost dont use qu*eer as an umbrella term because it is, in fact, a fucking slur thanks sharon
“hey, this word is being used as a weapon by our oppressors, it’d be good if you never took that weapon from them.”. plus gay is also a fucking slur lmao. it’s been used as a slur against members of the LGBT community for decades, and i’ve had “gay” yelled at me derogatorily much more than “queer”.
plus, asshole, we’ve been called the queer community for going on forty years. To attack our cis hetero oppressors, the streets were lined with posters saying “Not gay as in happy but queer as in fuck you”.
i don’t understand why you’re fighting so hard to make sure we use a word that makes the straights comfortable. maybe fuck off? i’m queer.
you don’t have to use queer as an umbrella term if you don’t want to, but guess what you call the community of people who DO like to use the term for themselves….? the fucking queer community. and you have no right to tell them they aren’t allowed to refer to themselves as queer, when the term is used against them.
stop pretending you understand the world becky lmao
oh wow, thanks for misgendering me, you disgusting transmisogynist. lmao
i’m a trans lesbian, becky. like i literally said “i’m queer” in that reblog, and you totally ignored it. just goes to show that “cishet” doesn’t actually mean “cisgender hetero” to you people, it means “person who disagrees with me”. any trans lesbian that disagrees with you on the discourse is instantly a cishet i guess. what a fucking hell site this is.
you know what becky? i think we should be besties. i’d put sparkles around the word “besties” if i had a way to do so.
are you one of those people who loves rewriting history to make it look like aces haven’t always had a place in the LGBT community?
you’re already displaying that you’re one of those assholes who spreads lies about how we “came together to fight homophobia and transphobia”. lmao, no, today we fight cis heteronormative patriarchy, meaning anyone who isn’t accepted as being straight by society at large is part of the LGBT community- and despite what violent bigots who try to scrub away our community history would tell you, that has literally always included aces.
back when the community was formed, however, while transgender people did help found the movement- we weren’t accepted in the community until decades later. so to say that we came together to fight transphobia is a pretty significant erasure of violence committed by cis LG individuals against trans women in the early years of the movement. so that by itself should be enough to call you a transphobe, but let’s keep going.
and oh wow, yeah. society totally views aces as straight.
i guess that’s why this sociological study found that both cisgender straight people and members of the LGBT community reacted to asexuality more negatively than they did any other sexuality. nothing says “straight privilege” like being the sexuality that straight people have the worst gut-reaction toward.
also, of all the sexuality groups studied, aces were most likely to be seen as not being human. and honestly, don’t we all know that being viewed as sub-human is the greatest privilege of all? i mean, that info alone should make it blatantly obvious that straight people view aces as being straight, right?
here’s some privileges aces/aros hold for being seen as straight:
1. being more likely to be viewed as being less human, and more “machine like”. ( source: x)
2. being more likely to be viewed as less human, and more “animal-like” (source: x)
3. being less likely to be rented an apartment (source at the end of the post)
4. being less likely to be hired for a job (source at the end of the post)
5. being raped with it being the rapists’ expressed hope that it makes the victim stop being asexual (this happens to straight people ALL THE TIME, right?)(source: x)
6. going through abusive corrective therapies in hopes that they will stop being asexual. (victim’s personal testimony in regards to this: x, x, x, x,)
these are all blatant signs that hetoronormative society at large treats asexuals exactly as they’d treat a straight person, and that the treatment of asexuals is in no way similar to that of a group being oppressed for their sexuality.
okay, that was some serious sarcasm i just used. let’s get serious again.
literally every strand of evidence on this matter points to asexuals being a group oppressed for their sexuality and despised by not only straight people, but members of the LGBT community- a space that’s meant to be a place of solace for those oppressed for their sexuality.
and while aces are definitely far from the only groups that experience the things above, they ARE the only group that experiences them and aren’t considered LGBT by you assholes.
and i’m calling you a “sga discourser” because only bigots like yourself use the term “SGA”, a term created to be used in a medical context. it’s still used today by the mormon church to refer to gay people they’re in the midst of “correcting”.
it puts the same bad taste in my mouth that “homosexual” does.
you spam their tags with mocking posts invalidating their suffering, and then preach that your safe space is being invaded.
you deny them the language necessary to separate themselves from those who do not share their experiences, thus severely damaging their ability to successfully form community spaces and protect themselves. (relevant posts: x, x, x)
but hey, i’m sure in that in a homophobic regime that murders anyone who is even slightly suspected of not being straight, a man who shows total repulsion at the idea of being sexual or romantic with a woman TOTALLY wouldn’t be on the chopping block. aces have NEVER suffered at the hand of hetero-superiority….more sarcasm, if you couldn’t tell.
historical revisionism is an acephobe’s favorite tool of the trade.
countless ace people discuss regularly how straight people have attacked and excluded them- how they’ve faced discrimination in day to day life. i provide sociological studies that prove these events occur- and your only response is to either admit that aces have always belonged in this community, or to say all those oppressed people lied about their experiences. something tells me you’ll accuse rape victims of lying about their own assault before you’d ever admit you were wrong. exclusionists like you always value your pride over oppressed peoples.
and let’s not pretend that this is just about “cishet” aces, it’s all about all aces in the community, who you’ll turn and call ‘cishet’ simply for being ace, despite them not being cisgender or heterosexual. they feel attacked for being ace, despite also having identities that you assholes see as being part of the community. (relevant posts : x,x)
i’ve said this like seven times within the past week, but before the word “asexual” became the most popular term for people without sexual attraction, they were referred to as being bisexual- and were active members of the bi community. here’s a tumblr post with links and quotations from people who were community members during that time, telling their personal experience with ace people’s presence in the LGBT community before they were called ‘ace’: x
the fact that you don’t know this just goes to show that you understand less than nothing about this community’s history- which is a shame for you, considering you’re weaponizing a rewritten version of our history as a weapon against an oppressed group. it would probably be best if you knew more about the LGBT folks whose stories you’re violently erasing.
the only way in which someone could reliably argue that aces are not inherently LGBT by virtue of being ace, is if they blatantly ignore- and even attempt to rewrite- the history of the LGBT community.
the hoops people will jump through to say that a group oppressed for their sexuality don’t belong in a community designed to protect and fight for people who are oppressed for their sexuality. being raped with the intention of it changing your sexuality? totally not something the LGBT community deals with, apparently! feeling an equal amount of attraction toward all genders? that apparently has nothing to do with us LGBT folks, sorry!
like. you take a definition of who does/does not belong in this community- a definition that’s existed under a decade (but all the SGA discoursers swear has been the definition from the beginning, because they LOVE historical revisionism), and you use it to force out members of the LGBT community.
“we’re not forcing them out, they’ve never been here to begin with! they’re only now asking to join!” haha, no. already disproven above, thank you. you are forcing them out by harassing them and depriving them of resources, and damaging their ability to form safe spaces for themselves.
to elaborate upon a way you damage their ability to form safe spaces: isn’t it convenient that whenever aces try to come up with a word for people who don’t go through their experiences, you all come up with different circular arguments about how the word is supposedly bigoted in thirty seven billion different ways, none of which actually hold up? like how it groups gays and bisexuals with straight people, just like literally every term of that nature in existence. ‘able bodied’, ‘cisgender’, ‘left handed’…by violently policing their language, you conveniently keep them from using these terms to separate themselves from allosexuals (gasp, i said it), making it virtually impossible for aces to form community safe spaces.
to elaborate upon another way you violate their ability to form safe spaces, consider that it’s virtually impossible for an ace teen to look up resources for themselves without being bombarded with the hateful shit you people perpetuate.
intentionally making it more difficult for an oppressed group to form safe spaces where they can’t be harassed, and publicly vilifying anyone who calls you out on it?
hm, that almost sounds like it’s a carefully calculated act of violence. not that i’d know anything about those!
i find it interesting how less than three years ago, the “A for ace” was an accepted part of the LGBT acronym, and yet acephobes today are already preaching that they never had a place in the community. like…i know you guys love to lie about our community history, but that was barely over two years ago. maybe wait a bit longer before cranking out the revisionist bullshit next time?
as i already said, transgender people weren’t accepted by the community until decades after we helped found the movement, and the arguments being used to exclude aces mimic the arguments that are still used today to attack trans women.
that second link is to a post where a TWERF saw an acephobic post that never explicitly mentioned which oppressed group they were talking about excluding (”Sometimes inclusion is a bad thing, we need them out of our safe spaces”), and the TWERF basically reblogs it going “yes!! so true!! keep males out of female spaces!” and the acephobe’s like ‘wat’ and the TWERF is like ‘wat?’.
the rhetoric is that fucking identical lmao.
first of all, if you don’t remember when “the a is for asexual” was the most popular interpretation, then you would literally have to be less than three years old. which wouldn’t suprise me, considering you’re such a whiney piss baby.
i wouldn’t be shocked at all if you’re a transmisogynyst. everyone else making your arguments so far has been, and i figure that birds of a feather flock together.
don’t preach to me about what our history with this community is.
don’t preach to me about who does and does not belong in this community, when the “drop the T” movement is still in full swing.
a few of the sources i put forward on this post are from people speaking of their personal experiences, which i remind you is an accepted form of evidence in virtually every court of law on this bright blue fucking planet. so don’t get any ideas about suddenly deciding that the voices of the oppressed are only valid when they agree with you.
sga discoursers like yourself are only looking to make this community unsafe (x,x)for an oppressed group that’s been part of this community since the beginning- before the term ‘asexual’ garnered the definition it currently has, those who didn’t feel sexual attraction were referred to as being bisexual, and were constantly involved with the LGBT community’s exploits.
the “a is for allies” thing is hilariously disingenuous, because you scream about keeping out cishets whenever ace people are brought up- but you’ll gladly accept non-ace cishets into our community spaces, on the offchance they might be in the closet. i’m certainly not against allowing closeted individuals into our community spaces, but it just seems odd that when someone walks up and says “i’m cisgender, heterosexual, and not ace.” you yell “welcome to the community!”, but when someone says ‘i’m cisgender, heteroromantic, and ace.” you suddenly turn on motherfucking Attack Mode™.
i’m all for allowing other closeted individuals a chance to enter our community spaces without jeopardizing themselves.
but the fact that you SGA discoursers are welcoming of non-ace cishets, makes it pretty clear who this hate movement actually targets.
and like.
who is even surprised that “cishet aces” was a ruse used to attack the entire ace community? you’ve all called transgender, gay, and bisexual aces “cishet” time and time again- whenever they step out of line when it comes to their opinion on The Discourse.
this isn’t about cishets.
it never was. lmao
the thing about SGA discoursers is the second anon’s turned on, “LGBT aces are always welcome, as long as they violently shun and harass all other aces!!”
quickly becomes
“All aces deserve to feel unsafe in the LGBT community, they need to form their own community and get out of ours.”(x)
this would be a good time to elaborate that “straight” as an orientation and “straight” as an oppressive power structure are two different things- for example, a trans woman who is solely attracted to binary men is straight in orientation, but does not contribute to cisnormative heteronormative patriarchy. the same is true of aces who refer to themselves as being straight.
in the majority of this post, when i say “straight”, i am referring to the position of privilege/the power structure. when i say “aces can not be straight”, i am only stating that they can not hold the position of privilege, not that they can’t be of that orientation.
all exclusionists are the same- acephobes, TWERFs, biphobes who think bisexuals in “opposite” gender relationships are straight…they all preach the following: “These people claim to be marginalized, but are actually part of the privileged group they say is oppressing them! They’re here to invade our safe spaces and steal our resources! We can prove that they’re part of this privileged group, using these arbitrary definitions of what that privileged group is- definitions we specifically design to include this so called marginalized group, and edit as necessary to make sure it always includes them! The lack of mainstream study into their oppression is proof it doesn’t exist! and any marginalization against them only happens because people mistake them for us!”– the cry of the twerf, the acephobe, and the biphobe.
seeing one of you acephobes say “straight people aren’t oppressed lmao” honestly gives me the same feeling in my chest as TWERFs saying “men aren’t oppressed lmao”.
not to mention the somewhat recent ‘bihet’ discourse, where people thought bisexuals in a relationship with the “opposite” gender were straight, and therefore would say “straight people aren’t oppressed lmao” to anyone who disagreed.
it’s a logical fallacy where the person insists that by proving a very obvious fact to be true, the rest of their point is also proven to be true. (ie “the sky is blue, therefore it’s made of blue raspberry ice cream. anyone who disagrees with me can be proven wrong by me providing proof that the sky is blue.”) you insist that one fact being true means a totally unrelated statement must also be true. the obvious fact being “straights aren’t oppressed”, the unrelated concept being “aces are straight”.
cishet aces don’t exist, male trans women don’t exist, bihets don’t exist. neither of us are part of the privileged group you’ve assigned us (”you” being exclusionists- if you’re going to recycle arguments used by TWERFs and biphobes, you obviously get bundled in with them.) calling aces ‘cishet’, and therefore aligning them with your oppressor, makes it easier to demonize them. calling trans women “male”, and therefore aligning them with their oppressors, makes it easier for TWERFs to demonize us.
nobody in their right mind would disagree that straight people have privilege over other sexualities, nobody in their right mind would disagree that men have privilege over other genders- and so by taking these easily proven facts and wrongfully aligning oppressed groups with their own oppressors, you can pretend that proving the existence of straight privilege is the same as proving that aces are straight. when it fucking isn’t lmao
nobody in their right mind would argue that straight people aren’t privileged, so when someone provides evidence of ace oppression, saying “straights aren’t oppressed lmao” makes people go “wow, i guess that statement is technically true.”. yeah, it’s true. and it’s also totally irrelevant, because we aren’t talking about straight people.
TWERFs do the same thing by derailing evidence of transgender women’s oppression with “do you people honestly think men are oppressed”. and it’s the same tactic. it’s literally precisely the same tactic. because you force them to either
A. acknowledge that the statement you made is technically correct if taken out of context, in that men/straights aren’t oppressed. if they do this, then you yell out “then why are you acting like they are and saying we should let them invade our safe spaces?!”
or
B. force them to argue with you that the oppressed group and the privileged group are not the same…trans women aren’t men, aces are not straight, bisexuals with “opposite” gender partners are not straight. which exclusionists refuse to accept, regardless of how much evidence there is. all the evidence is bullshit, all the sociological studies are unscientific, etc. they’ll come up with any excuse humanly possible. bonus points if they can vilify you by saying you’re a bigot for trying to protect the oppressed group in question.
TWERFs, acephobes, and people who think “bihets” exist…they all see themselves as rejecting their oppressor from their community. they think they’re bravely forcing their oppressor away lmao. you’re all literally exactly the same. the only meaningful distinction is which oppressed group you’re attacking- your tactics, your motives, they’re all the same.
you love the adrenaline rush of yelling “there’s my oppressor! I get to force them out!”, without any of the consequence of attacking someone who is actually your oppressor. oppressed groups that go virtually unrecognized by society make for extremely good punching bags in these situations, and any community-wide damage your hatred causes is seen as collateral to you.
both twerfs and acephobes will argue to the death that the oppressed group they’re attacking is really their privileged oppressor, and that all the solid evidence proving otherwise is garbage somehow. you’re precisely the same, sharon.
whenever you people decide you hate a section of this community, you redefine the parameters of what is/is not LGBT, and then you pretend that that definition has always been the case. and as the cherry on top, you paint the group as being part of your vile oppressors, so that it’s easier to demonize them and mock their suffering. because straight people TOTALLY view aces as being straight, that’s why straight aces are less likely to be hired to a position than non-ace straights. that’s why studies have shown that straight people react more negatively to the idea of asexuality than they do to any other sexuality. that’s why aces undergo corrective rape with the intention of it making them no longer ace. (sources: x, x)
remember that time SGA discoursers found out that an LGBT hotline would start supporting asexuals, to help talk young ace teens out of suicide? because regular suicide hotlines wouldn’t address the problems faced by someone oppressed for their sexuality?
and remember when said sga discoursers became so furious that ace oppression was being recognized, that they didn’t care if it was stopping suicides, and demanded it stop? (a comprehensive post on this matter: x)
the ace communitys’ suicide rate has been rising in recent years, and i wouldn’t be shocked if it’s a direct result of being denied anti-suicide resources designed for people oppressed for their sexuality.
a group oppressed for their sexuality belongs in a community partially intended for people oppressed for their sexuality. this should not be a controversial statement.
by denying them the resources they need, you’re committing an act of violence. (but what’s that, hypothetical acephobe? i hear you say ”but carmen, how could robbing ace teens of suicide prevention resources be violent? how could flooding their tags with hate be violent? how could mocking positivity posts intended for minors who feel broken be violent? how could it be violent to say that all aces should feel unsafe in the LGBT community regardless of whether they’re gay or trans? (x)” if you have to ask yourself this, you’re being willifully ignorant, and already know the answer to your question.)
not to mention how many SGA discoursers are preaching “a is for ally!” now, making it clear that you’re totally fine with cishets being in the community, as long as they aren’t ace. like, let’s stop pretending we can’t see through the wool you’re trying to pull over our eyes here- this was never about cishets. this was about the systemic exclusion and vile harrassment of a portion of this community, forcing them out and demonizing them by whatever means necessary. which reminds me of a few other movements i don’t get along with(relevant post: x)
also they’ve got “don’t sass me shaniqua” in their description, obviously indicating they think names primarily associated with black communities are hilarious and demeaning. this racism might be internalized, if they’re black, but it’s certainly there either way. but an acephobe also being a racist is the least surprising development in the history of mankind tbh.
aces are a group oppressed for their sexuality, and therefore belong in the LGBT community. i expect your reply to be you screaming “STRAIGHTS AREN’T LGBT” at the top of your lungs, and yelling “everything you said is bullshit!!” without providing any evidence. bonus points if you criticize my comparing acephobes to TWERFs, and therefore speaking over an actual trans woman in regards to what is/is not similar to transmisogyny.
so yeah. you’re a transmisogynist, in that you misgendered me, and called me “cishet” after i sound outright “i’m queer”, you find calling people predominantly black names like “shaniqua” to be hilarious (because being black is demeaning in your eyes i suppose.), so you’re a racist. and you aren’t afraid to erase gigantic parts of the LGBT communities’ history, so, frankly, you’re a homophobe.
my prescription to treat your bigotry, internalized and otherwise: sit down and read our community history for the first time in your life, becky.
@h8keepers you’re more than welcome to get in on this, buddy. if you want your bigotry hung from the laundry string for everyone to see, i’d be really happy to air it out for you. i really encourage you to try and argue how violently rewriting the history of our community so as to erase any evidence of a particular oppressed group (which, btw, fits the dictionary definition of genocide regardless of whether anyone is physically harmed) isn’t spitting on the graves of this communities’ pioneers.
come on. i’m here, i’m queer, and i’m sick of historical revisionism and bigoted exclusionists who paint oppressed groups to resemble their opppressors (TWERFs, biphobes, acephobes). if me and becky here are besties, you and me can be besties too. we can do fun activities, like having you ignore all the arguments i made so you can rehash the argumentative points i just debunked. or you could call my sources bullshit without providing any evidence they aren’t legitimate! that’s something acephobes love doing, right? see, we’re gonna have lots of fun together.
carmen you are under arrest for that Sick burn that was the length of an essay
yall rlly expect me to read all that smh but anyway love you too karen
here’s a summarization: “you’re protecting your community from straight oppressors the same way TWERFs protect their community from male oppressors. which is to say you’re actually just attacking an oppressed group by ignoring evidence of their oppression and rewriting history to make it look like they haven’t been here all along. literally all the evidence shows that non-ace straights are not accepting of aces, evidence i’ve sourced above.
also you call anyone who disagrees with you “cishet”, regardless of whether they’re a non-ace trans lesbian. which is to say you’re an ugly, ugly transmisogynist.
also i’m suppose to believe you have a comprehensive understanding of LGBT history when you can’t even read an informal essay about why aces are humans. lmao
it’s been great talking becky, i can’t wait to see you and the kids at the community potluck. we can do fun acephobe activities, like scrubbing history of all mentions of an oppressed group, and accusing rape victims of being liars.
jesus!! i wasnt referring specifically to you when i said cishetS jesus christ i rlly wanna see where you copypasted that entire novel from pal
dude, literally not a single cishet had reblogged the version of the post you reblogged. you called someone “cishet”, and i was the only other person who had interacted with the post. what kind of dumbass do you take me for? how much effort are you going to put into weaseling out of the obvious fact you called me cishet? and you were blatantly saying “cishets” in regards to what we were saying on the post.
like do you honestly want me to believe that you replied to a post without any cishets speaking on it, said “the cishets are burning my crops”, and that you were supposedly talking about some hypothetical far away cishet? and not referring to someone on the post? lmao.
like, if i reblogged one of your posts straight from you, and said “cisgender people disgust me”, and then said later “oh i meant cis people in general, i wasn’t talking about you!”
you’d be like. “then why the fuck did you say it in a reblog of my post that didn’t have anyone else speaking on it?” lmao.
you saying “cishet” was blatantly targeted at the people reblogging your post, like you can’t argue that away.
and i love how when a trans woman accuses you of transmisogyny, your first instinct is to invalidate her. that’s so casually bigoted that it almost reaches the point of being endearing. almost.
you instantly defaulted to calling a trans person “cishet” once you realized she thought aces were people. it’s something acephobes do on a daily basis. (x)
and again, you expect me to believe you have a comprehensive knowledge of LGBT history, when you can’t even sit still long enough to read a sourced essay about how aces aren’t straight, and have always been involved in the LGBT community? lmao. i’m calling your bluff, dumbass. you don’t know the first two things about our history, and what little you do know you’re trying to rewrite to create a falsified version that excludes aces.
it’s like…
me: here’s a detailed, sourced argument in regards to how aces face oppression similar, if not identical, to the rest of the LGBT community- and how erasure of this is a calculated attack on an oppressed group, similar to how TWERFs frame trans women as their privileged oppressors, despite no evidence of such.
you:
like. lmao, typical of a bigot to stick their fingers in their ears when someone provides evidence of their bigotry. stop pretending you have any clue what you’re doing becky lol
honestly yknow i was genuinely not referring to you and didnt mean to offend you with that statement but if you actually wanna be offended then have fun lmao
how stupid do you think i am.
you called someone cishet, and i was the only other person who had commented on the version of the post you reblogged.
also, i love how you’re painting a trans woman as looking for something to be offended about. you’re literally trying to invalidate the feelings of a trans woman you called cis. lmao
you’re cishet anyway. (not directed at you, uncledicked! directed at a totally different person who hasn’t interacted with this post at all. because it TOTALLY makes sense for me to put it in a reply to you when i intend it for someone else!)
go deepthroat a cactus. (not directed at you, uncledicked! directed at a totally different person who hasn’t interacted with this post at all. because it TOTALLY makes sense for me to put it in a reply to you when i intend it for someone else!)
you’re a disgusting transmisogynist who isn’t afraid to silence trans women as long as it means you get to keep rewriting our history to exclude aces. (this one is actually meant for you, uncledicked.)
lmao i love how i said “Your bigotry reminds me of the behavior of the people who have been murdering trans women for decades” and you later say “if you actually wanna be offended then have fun lmao”.
like. wow. i can’t even put into words how deep a hatred of trans women that shows. acephobes and transphobes, forever walking hand in hand.
totally not a violent transmisogynist tho.
I am hereby retiring OMFG I have NEVER
IN ALL MY BORN DAYS
SEEN SUCH AN EPIC TAKEDOWN.
Never.
I’m speechless at the utter fucking majesty and i urge you all to save a link to this somewhere because it is basically a masterpost on anti-ace oppression.
Me: I CAN’T BELIEVE IT ONLY HAS 16 NOTES River: BLOW IT UP HONEY
trans woman: you’re being transmisogynist
uncledicked: lol stop being offended
n I C E
@courteousmingler you are amazing, although don’t expect the OP to do anything other than the usual immature lolreplies as SGA discourers always do. (And I’m saying that from experience, since “queer is a slur” is their nonsequitur of choice whenever confronted with biphobia and cissexism as well. Because respectability politics, that will ensure equality and actual respect!!!) People with a critical thinking capacity who aren’t motivated solely by hate and bigotry, though, will appreciate it.
[Gif of the WWE Smackdown logo shining and turning against a blue and black background. This mod hasn’t seen such a brutal beatdown since Brock Lesner destroyed Zack Gowen right in front of his own mother. I can only expect Jerry Lawler to say something misogynistic soon, so enjoy this feeling while it lasts.]
